Intercoolers & heatexchangers

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Re: Intercoolers

Postby sfelise on Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:18 am

ronin wrote:I never said I came up with the castings for the kit, I did say that BWR just ripped off the Greddy casting that's all.....No real R$D on their part.......You're right the Gotham/ronin tune will give the same results on ether kit...It's the aditude of BWR that pisses me off that's why they don't have our tune and trust me they want it bad........They [BWR] did fuck up big time putting the alternator alongside the header but what do I know.....


And just from a keep it simple standpoint it would be better to leave the alternator alone.

ronin wrote:The best place for the intercooler is on the drivers side, there are too many service items on the pasenger side [ alternator. drive belt, A/C]..


That's a good point. Even with a tilting clam trying to do something like change the supercharger pulley would be more trouble with the plumbing on that side, but not the end of the world.

ronin wrote:I would like to see a chargecooler but that would add to the cost of the new kit big time so for now we'll see what they get as is......it will still be better than BWR/Sector....


Actually this is sounding pretty good depending on the final cost. Someone (like me) could get a less expensive setup with air/air now, which would be a big step up over BWR/Sector kits, and then later go air/water, build the engine, and step up again. :bounce:
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby Griffin on Fri Apr 04, 2008 9:27 am

Its all relative. a front mounted A2A intercooler on a front engine car is a very efficient affair and probably the most practical choice for a street machine. MOST homebrew A2A systems are more efficient than MOST homebrew A2W systems because people tend to undersize pumps and heat exchangers and resivoirs and the systems tend to heat soak over time.

That being said, dump icewater in the resivoir and its easy to exceed 100% efficiency on an A2W intercooler. Spray Notrous or CO2 on a A2A intercooler and you can do the same thing. Or hell, just spray methanol in the intake tube 1 foot in front of the throttle plate and do the same thing with no intercooler at all. (Just don't do it on pump gas)

Everything is relative - It all depends on your application and budget.
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby Ade on Mon Apr 07, 2008 12:26 am

I still think A2W water is the best solution for the Elise\Exige as the frontal area for the heat exchanger can never be made big enough to get efficent cooling unless it is in the front, that means A2W is the only way to go. On big power front engine cars A2A is normally best as you can put the heat exchanger in all that lovely cool air in front of the engine rad.
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Wed Apr 09, 2008 2:27 pm

Well I caught this on the other channel..... :shock:
========================================================================================================
Thomasio
Internat'l Man of Mystery

Now accepting deposits: ("the aliens have landed...")

Really Light Stuff(TM) today announces its "plug n' play" intercooler upgrade for the Exige S.

The benchmark for the performance of the Really Light Stuff(TM) Intercooler was the OEM intercooler on the Exige Cup car.

You can use your stock intercooler pipes / tubes (but why would you, when you can use the Really Light Stuff(TM) Tubes?...)

The RLS Intercooler uses the same mounting points as the Exige Cup intercooler. Order your RLS Intercooler in either plain aluminum, clear anodized, or black anodized. If you are using, or plan to use water/methanol injection (available separately or as a bundle) the RLS Intercooler is availalbe with an optimally located bung for the water/methanol injectoin nozzle. Also, be sure to order a set of Really Light Stuff(TM) Tubes (get rid of those nasty cast aluminum anchors) with integrated IAT sensor bung, opimally located downstream of the water/methanol injection nozzle: $245 in plain aluminum, $275 in clear anodized or black anodized finish.

The RLS Intercooler: lighter than going air-to-water. Compared to the stock Exige S intercooler: lower pressure loss, higher pumping efficiency for your supercharger, lower intake air temperatures, better heat transfer, stock looks.

Estimated time of delivery: less than 30 days. Deposit: $100 (refundable).

Lotus charges about $2,100 for their Cup intercooler. The RLS Intercooler, anodized, is priced at $1,380 plus shipping. (Subtract $100 if you don't require anodizing. RLS Intercooler bundled with RLS Water Injection price to be announced.)
=======================================================================================================


Funny the Lotus GT3 ran with the same heavy alu tubes without worry about weight :D and also cleaned house with the 255cup intercooler back in 06.......no water injection :D , maybe a bit more fuel but no water......

No real test data just a lite tube........... dudes just take a good shit before you go for a drive.........Like anyone could feel 10-90 lbs. additional in this car....... more like a "Really Light Wallet"....


Funny thing my low boost 12psi. A/W chargecooler bits cost me about $1,300., 20rwhp increase..

Now don't forget to tune :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Thu Apr 10, 2008 7:33 am

Has anyone checked out these guys yet....The price is unbelievable… :shock:

http://www.frozenboost.com/index.php?os ... 1147b82c24
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Thu Apr 10, 2008 9:32 am

Guys take note of the pancake griddle used as a heat shield on the winning Lotus GT3 car...
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:19 am

I'm getting sick and tired of these guys posting this crap without any "real testing", spouting claims without any data to back them up.......

No way have these guys done their homework....just preying on Lotus owners that don't know better... :twisted:

=========================================================================================================


Today, 06:44 AM #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trompazo
I kept the stock intercooler. I'd be interested in upgrading it as well, if it shows to be effective. But I think the biggest gains will be from increased airflow and water/meth injection.

The RLS Intercooler sheds more heat, yes, but it also is less restrictive than the OEM intercooler and the Cup intercooler. At high RPM the intercooler creates a substantial restriction to airlflow, so improving the intercooler will benefit the throttle response, and supercharger efficiency (less parasitic loss).
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:34 am

http://www.lotustalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=54274



I wanna see the flowbench data on these claims.......oh wait they don't have any.. :lol: :lol:
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby Stan on Fri Apr 11, 2008 10:18 am

I thought you didn't believe in analysis Frank!!??!!!? (J/K)
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Fri Apr 11, 2008 10:28 am

Stan maybe you missed a few hundred posts ?.........My testing produced results unlike some that just take things apart to make believe they're "experts" on everything... :D
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Tue Apr 22, 2008 7:50 am

I love the so called experts....this makes me want a drink..... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

These guys don't have a fuckin clue......as to what works....but they want to sell you their crap... :shock:


Quote from Lotus Talk :lol: :lol: :lol: :

Today, 07:39 AM #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kohtzing
Will these new intercoolers work and provide a performance benefit with the stock roof?

Great question. The short answer is: yes, but not as much as with better ducting.

Here are the benefits: 1) lower restriction: less pressure loss, 2) higher cross sectional area: faster return from a "heat soak" state, 3) higher internal volume: better heat transfer, 4) higher thermal capacitance: prevents spikes in intake air temperatures.

As to point #4, here is an analogy. (No, it isn't a perfect analogy, but it is helpful). Let's say that the heat in the compressed air is "absorbed" by the mass of the intercooler. The intercooler can "absorb" so much heat before it can no longer function as an effective heat exchanger, which means that the intake air temperatures rise to unhealthy levels.

In our analogy, we imagine an average person drinking alcohol. Let's call him "Stocker." Along with this average person, there is a large athletic guy, we'll call him "RLS."

In our analogy, alcohol is like heat...

Both drinkers have about one beer per hour... and we don't notice much of a difference between how they are affected, because their bodies are processing the alcohol at about the same rate. (Did I mention that RLS also has a bigger liver? His body actually processes the alcohol a bit quicker, but at low levels of alcohol intake we don't notice a difference.)

But now we see the bar tender is about to turn it up a notch... the very lovely bar tendress pours three shots of the finest Mezcal for each of our brave drinkers. Stocker does his best to throw down the drinks, but within minutes he is so buzzed that he needs to sit down. His liver is gettting to work removing the alcohol from his body, but it has more than it can deal with. On the other hand, "RLS" threw back his shots and minutes later cracks a smile and said "bring it on!" His large mass is able to absorb more alcohol without his blood alcohol level raising much. And his larger liver means that he will be back to sober a bit quicker than our lightweight friend Stocker.

Oh no! Here comes the bartendress again... she has three more shots! What's Stocker going to do? He's already legally drunk, his liver isn't keeping up with the amount of alcohol coming in anyway... look, it looks like the alcohol isn't even absorbing into his body... it seems to be all over the floor! RLS grins, downs the three drinks, and he's still standing.

Back to heat exchangers... the heat exchanger with more cross sectional area is able to shed that heat faster (like alcohol with a larger liver). The heat exchanger with greater thermal capacity is like the drinker with the larger body.

Not the best analogy, but it should get some thinking about thermal capacity... it's a good thing, especially combined with the ability to shed heat more rapidly.
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:12 am

Now the carbon fiber roof looks cool and I'd put one on my car for bling but ..........

The RLS Intercooler, anodized, is priced at $1,380 plus shipping. (Subtract $100 if you don't require anodizing.)

The roof is $3488 in carbon fiber (without the window seals), or $2880 in fiberglass.
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for the price of the carbon fiber roof alone you could add a A/W chargecooler and a Gotham tune..... :shock: :shock: :shock:

So boys and girls the rip off line starts on Lotus Talk...enjoy :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Wed May 07, 2008 4:01 pm

Funny I read on Lotus Talk this dribble.......
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote: shoco

This kit puts the cool air through the intercooler core first then to the engine bay. The complete top of the engine bay is wide open mesh . On the bottom pan there are two large openings for the lower a arms. Studied in wind tunnel they are so large that they limit the diffuser effectiveness. This implies they allow excessive airflow through them. You also have the three naca ducts on the bottom.

The right side panel also has a small access hole/flap for A/C service that also will pass some air in the vicinity of the alternator for people who have raised these concerns.

========================================================================================================

Zero data to back up any claims but bull shit to sell crap to exige S guys.....

Hell I got a 15*f drop on the intake manifold temps by removing the wire mesh from my side scoops..... :D

and he's wants S guys to block all the engine cooling air and reroute it to the intercooler with shit drier hose, what a fuckin joke... :lol: :lol: :lol:

where do I buy this shit ?.. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Mon May 12, 2008 12:27 pm

Still zero data........not even Bell has data for the intercooler other than it offers less back pressure.....I know because I spoke to them.. :D
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Re: Intercoolers

Postby ronin on Mon May 12, 2008 8:44 pm

Oh yeah and now they're sold through BWR who as we all know do no testing...What a great partnership. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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